[nycphp-talk] Java provides???

Michael B Allen ioplex at
Wed Aug 12 15:01:31 EDT 2009

On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 2:33 PM, Paul A Houle<paul at> wrote:
>   If I were a Windows shop,  I'd go for ASP.NET.  C# is a wonderful
> language,  a living language.  Microsoft is continually improving it,  while
> it seems Java is stuck in reverse.  Linq is just great,  and the C# generics
> system makes Java generics look like a joke.  There's a lot of junk in
> ASP.NET,  but if you avoid the junk,  it's a system that's better in J2EE in
> all ways (Java Web Faces is as much of a stinker as ASP.NET Web Forms)  The
> big trouble is that people from straight-windows backgrounds can't tell
> what's junk and what's not -- w/ a decade of PHP experience (and a healthy
> phobia of accidentally being stateful) I've found it easy to find the good
> stuff in ASP.NET;  recent versions of IIS do a good job of surviving
> exceptional events inside ASP.NET,  better than most Tomcat installations
> I've seen.
>   Of course,  ASP.NET means you're stuck with Windows...  If you can't
> accept that,  you've got to use something else.

I agree with you about this. Microsoft has always had good language
support. C# as a language is clearly superior to Java. However, Java
still has a huge advantage in that it is platform independent. C# may
be an ISO standard but that is meaningless if the class libraries are
tied to the Windows platform. If a good platform independent
implementation of C# with good platform independent libraries turned
up, it could do very well.

I also agree with you about all the "junk". C# and Java both suffer
the "fluffy programming" problem. The number of classes and half-baked
attempts at OO abstractions is unnecessarily complex and nonuniform.
The number of C# assemblies is staggering. Why does logging in Java
need 17 classes with all sorts of complex OO relations? That's just


Michael B Allen
Java Active Directory Integration

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