NYCPHP Meetup

[inforequest]

Mark Armendariz enolists-at-gmail.com |nyphp dev/internal group use| wrote:

>     As for small claims, I live by the truth that *nothing* costs less
>     than
>     $5k, regardless of price. Even if the market says $2k it's not
>     true...
>     everything costs more than $5k to manage should things go even
>     slightly
>     wrong. 
>
>
> This is untrue.  There is a great deal of good work in the small 
> project sector, but it takes experience to pick out the ones that will 
> be 'good clients'.  I've had my issues with horrible clients (one's 
> that still send threatening email and voice mails to this day), and I 
> generally chalked it up to experience.  In that past year alone, I've 
> had at least 20 sub-$5k.  They were quick, easy, paid on time or even 
> (gasp!) early - as in 100% up front.
>
Hmm.. after reading your post I think perhaps we are miscommunicating. 
It sounds like those "quick, easy, paid on time" projets of yours are 
exactly the kind I call "$5k projects". Had they not been as quick as 
anticipated, or paid on time, they would have caused hassle you would 
have had to reconsider due to the cost of pursuit.  Lucky you there were 
no issues. Or perhaps it was not luck:

> I'm a big fan of being careful, drawing up a solid contract, keeping a 
> lawyer on retainer, etc.

How careful can one be and especially with contracts, for a deal that 
earns less than $5k? Not with my lawyers nor with my hourly. That was 
partly my point. Of course it is my *personal* ruleof thumb about the 
$5k mark... it might be different for different situations.

> But the idea that anyone with a project under $5k is a swindler is a 
> horrible way to look at our business and is self-perpetuating.

Ummm... I didn't intend to imply that. However I do believe there are 
*many* business people in that market who  I would  suggest  have a 
business model that monetizes the channel at least as much as the 
customer. That means they seek to make money off the various players and 
not just the client. Sometimes they only win work via low bid, and 
monetize the channel via methods such as those described.

> After 7 years in the business, I can honestly say that some of my BEST 
> clients could never afford someone with a 5 figure minimum.  And they 
> come early and often.

This also belies the truth. They come often implies they are repeats. 
Repeats are valuable - everyone agrees. They have a relatively low 
overhead as clients. So doesn't that mean it is worthwhile to take on 
some risk with the first project, because you are banking on repeat 
(lower overhead) business? That was exactly my point prior.. and a 
decent approach imho. However, that initial sub-$5k project, on my 
books, is a break even or a loss leader.

Perhaps I was to colorful in my descriptions, but I feel we don't disagree.

-=john andrews
http://www.seo-fun.com