[nycphp-talk] ColdFusion vs PHP (Ruby, Perl....)
anthony wlodarski
anthony at thrillist.com
Thu May 1 17:58:16 EDT 2008
That would be a good laugh in itself right there. Woe, look at our
demise with this lovely drawn graph!
-Anthony
Webmaster wrote:
> I can't seem to locate enough detailed information on the basis for that
> PHP usage graph to comment.
> But I would think it silly, were there to be a Graph showing PHP
> declining steadily, on the PHP site. =D
>
> -Ed
>
> Kristina Anderson wrote:
>> This looks really interesting, but they say that
>>
>> "In the April 2008 survey we received responses from 165,719,150
>> sites. Most of this month's growth of 3.1 million sites is seen in the
>> US, with Google's Blogger service alone adding 1.1 million extra sites."
>>
>> But the graph below says that total active sites (red line) number
>> slightly more than 66,400,000 ...?
>>
>> Are they including inactive sites in their number of +/- 20 million
>> sites using PHP? If so how would that affect the accuracy of this
>> survey? (i.e. if someone goes out and buys a domain, then replies to
>> this survey saying "we are going to use PHP" but never actually does
>> so...?)
>>
>> --Kristina
>>
>>
>>
>>> Would this work for quantifying PHP usage:
>>>
>>> http://www.php.net/usage.php
>>>
>>> Now find that CF usage link and compare the two.
>>>
>>> -Anthony
>>>
>>> Webmaster wrote:
>>>
>>>> Kristina Anderson wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Ed, I agree, it would be great if we could find some methodology
>>>>>
>> that
>>>>> could prove beyond a shadow of a doubt on an empirical basis that
>>>>>
>> PHP
>>>>> is a more popular platform than Cold Fusion. I can't adequately
>>>>> defend my contention to your exacting standards at the present
>> moment,
>>>>> because you're right, I don't have the data. But I believe that
>>>>>
>> the
>>>>> data is gatherable and that my theory is valid.
>>>> I do too. But I would like it quantified as well.
>>>>
>>>>> So anyone have any ideas how to do that, links, information,
>> empirical
>>>>> studies, etc. etc & etc ... bring 'em on.
>>>>>
>>>>> We could do an empirical analysis of job postings on 10 or so
>> general
>>>>> tech job boards over a time period of a year...?
>>>>>
>>>> That sounds interesting.
>>>>
>>>>> PS Ed, your own link to the TIOBE website showed that they listed
>>>>>
>> Cold
>>>>> Fusion at the bottom of the popularity grid...and PHP was in the
>>>>>
>> top
>>>>> half. But you're saying that you have "problems with their
>>>>> methodology", OK. But you can have problems with any methodology
>>>>>
>> or
>>>>> means of proof, and that in and of itself is an emotional
>>>>> response...based on your beliefs and temperament...and btw there's
>>>>> nothing wrong with that! :=]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> I believe this to be a straw man.
>>>> I never said I had "problems with their methodology". I said "which
>>>>
>> i
>>>> think are erroneous", and logically so.
>>>> I posted a link to the 2 illogical assumptions that support the
>> TIOBE
>>>> indexes as being fallacious.
>>>> I will clearly list them here, as it seems you didn't follow that
>> link
>>>> (poor scholarship):
>>>> # that the number of search engine hits for the phrase “/foo/
>>>> programming” is proportional to the “popularity” of that language.
>>>> # that the proportionality /is the same for different languages/.
>>>> It is therefore logically unsound to deduce that the TIOBE indexes
>>>>
>> are
>>>> correct in a truly accurate esteem.
>>>> All they are graphing reduces to search engine results, and nothing
>>>>
>> more.
>>
>>>>> I mean let's face it, people have "proved beyond doubt" all sorts
>>>>>
>> of
>>>>> things which flat out ain't so, right?
>>>>>
>>>>> -- Kristina
>>>>>
>>>> I'm not sure what you are looking to express with that (perhaps
>>>> rhetorical?) question.
>>>>
>>>> <X>Out of curiosity<X>
>>>> <XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX>
>>>> What would be an example of something "proved beyond doubt"
>> that "flat
>>>> out ain't so"?
>>>> (Please refrain from listing some historic event of ignorance, such
>>>>
>> as
>>>> meat becoming maggots or the Earth being flat. We are discussing a
>>>> comparison of actual market holding betwixt two modern programming
>>>> languages. Feel free to respond off list.)
>>>> <XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX>
>>>>
>>>> In fact, there is not a clearly quantified amount of conclusive
>>>> information to accurately deduce that PHP (or any other language)
>> holds
>>>> this or that particular portion of the 'market'. Therefore, to
>> propose
>>>> we find a 'reason' for PHP holding the majority of the 'market
>> share',
>>>> is pure nonsense, as we do not know that PHP holds such a portion.
>>>>
>> We
>>>> may as well propose to find a reason for which Coldfusion holds the
>>>> largest share of the market, or Python, or Flex, or Java, or
>> COBOL...
>>
>>>> Perhaps this thread may be a catalyst to develop a better means of
>>>> accurately surveying language utilization in a granular fashion.
>>>>
>>>> -Ed
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>
>>>> NYPHPCon 2006 Presentations Online
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>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
>>> --
>>> Anthony Wlodarski
>>> PHP/MySQL Developer
>>> www.thrillist.com
>>> 560 Broadway, Suite 308
>>> New York, NY 10012
>>> p 646.274.2435
>>> f 646.557.0803
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> New York PHP Community Talk Mailing List
>>> http://lists.nyphp.org/mailman/listinfo/talk
>>>
>>> NYPHPCon 2006 Presentations Online
>>> http://www.nyphpcon.com
>>>
>>> Show Your Participation in New York PHP
>>> http://www.nyphp.org/show_participation.php
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> New York PHP Community Talk Mailing List
>> http://lists.nyphp.org/mailman/listinfo/talk
>>
>> NYPHPCon 2006 Presentations Online
>> http://www.nyphpcon.com
>>
>> Show Your Participation in New York PHP
>> http://www.nyphp.org/show_participation.php
>>
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> New York PHP Community Talk Mailing List
> http://lists.nyphp.org/mailman/listinfo/talk
>
> NYPHPCon 2006 Presentations Online
> http://www.nyphpcon.com
>
> Show Your Participation in New York PHP
> http://www.nyphp.org/show_participation.php
>
--
Anthony Wlodarski
PHP/MySQL Developer
www.thrillist.com
560 Broadway, Suite 308
New York, NY 10012
p 646.274.2435
f 646.557.0803
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